Supplement talk

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Sean's picture
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Supplement talk

Just wanted to create a thread about supplements in general and talk about how and what everybody uses.

I know Joe, Kori and I use them, but more sparingly than a lot of folks out there. Hence my creating this thread. Like most bodybuilders, I think its safe to say we have each gone through times in the past where we use them more or less, but with the research that is out and with the simple application of good science, its pretty clear that you just don't need to get aggressive with these things.

Some of the basics that have been proven time and again to be helpful:

 - Creatine monohydrate. The most studied supplement ever. Not one negative consequence ever found in healthy humans and its effectiveness is not questioned.

- BCAA. Protein is your friend if you're an athlete...and BCAA's are the building blocks. Good to have at certain times, particularly when dieting. BCAA's are used when you are training and your serum levels will be maintained whether you supplement them or not. Meaning if you don't put them in your body, your body will strip them from you muscle tissue. Not cool. These are less critical when you are in a solid caloric surplus.

- Glutamine. Controversial to a degree. But its the most abundant amino in the body and it has glycogen-sparing properties, making a good thing. 

You can throw a high-quality multivitamin in the mix if you want, along with a high-quality whey protein, but I don't even consider those supplements. They are just part of my nutrition and eating. Any other supplements that you guys use on a regular basis?

I take a pre-workout supplement but do so more for the caffiene bump than anything. Beyond that, simple seems to be the best when it comes to "off-season/non-dieting strategies.

1) Protein and carbs prior to the workout

2) Carbs and maybe some BCAA during the workout if you can spare the macros

3) Protein and carbs after the workout

Looking forward to what you guys have to say here.

CSCS and WNBF PRO
Cytrainer913's picture
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Hey Sean,

Gotta love the basics as you have said, your creatine and BCAAS around the workouts with some whey isolate mixed in pre and post workout. These have been the tried and true supps that you won't be wasting your money on.

A couple other I have tried now and really think they give the workouts a little extra UMPH, is the USP labs stuff, love the Anabolic Pump and Powerfull, along with thast new preworkout Jack3d, man get some good pumps and the weight is heading up nicely, on the body and what we are lifting.

 

Dedicated to be the best I can be
castin's picture
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I'll second that on the Jack3d. If it does one thing it gets you through he workout:bigsmile:

Laid back European . . . it has been said . .
Alan's picture
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I am not too different to Sean. I have been a supplement freak in the past, but now all that is behind me. Who knows what you are ingesting when you read the labels of some of this garbage. Wow, it certainly took me some time to come to that conclusion! Maybe in my next life I will save some money!

My exceptions are that I have dropped glutamine and am using up my current supply of bcaa's. Not sure if I will continue with these. Do they make a difference? No idea. I am using a pretty high quality whey isolate after the workout and that may well be good enough.

Nearly forgot. I have dabbled with creatine years ago but now I have decided to use it on a regular basis. Not too much, only 2 or 3 grams per day. After all, this is the most researched sports supplement ever and the majority of reports are positive.

Focus forward...
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We are drug tested at work and now they test for steroids so I have stopped basically all supps except for my multi vitamin, fish oils, extra calcium, BCAA, a lil creatine, and glutamine.
I have to admit, I feel just as good if not better, than when I was experimenting with just about everything I saw or read about or got for free at a show.  Now I am very careful to check labels to make sure I am not risking a false positive test result.  Better to be safe than sorry.
Of course my bank account seems to stretch out longer now that I am not turning my kitchen into a supplement store, lol.

Ran a 5k (www.cjsbus.org) with Cameron and Lynnea dominated the kids' dash - good way to start a Saturday!
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Glutamine controversial to a degree?  Sean?  Dude?  Do I have to copy the entire old thread from the old site where I beat Layne into oblivion on the subject?  I think he probably takes 8 tbsps a day now! 

 

All aminos are likely unncessary if you consume enough protein and time it well.  BUT, 5 g of BCAAs have the same effect of 20-25 g of protein, so if pre- or post-cardio or training, you want fast "protein" or aminos, what's easier than 5 g of BCAA and without the stomach load?  Glutamine is a glucogenic amino that simply spares muscle glycogen and thus muscle.  Being something like 68% of muscle amino content, if you keep glutamine high, you're less catabolic.  I recommend it before and after training.

 

Studying for the ISSN exam, I read more about Arginine than I had in the past and was quite interested in the research.  Anyone have favorable experiences with it?

Laid back European . . . it has been said . .
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Apart from the pre-Workout, Arginine / Nitric Oxide based " drinks " that are available, I have had little experience. I have never really taken enough due to the fact that these drinks are illegal for consumption, here in Norway. I decided a while ago that I couldn't understand half of the items on the label and I would drop all thoughts of using them.  Having said that and depending on which product I used, I did feel it gave me something. Whether that was due to the caffeine which is usually present or the Nicotinic Acid which is in some of them, I have no idea.

I have read that Arginine can help in lowering blood pressure and being a precursor of nitric oxide, helps benefit the heart & circulatory system. I know that there have been studies carried out on angina, cardiovascular and erectile dysfunction. No idea about the results, but it sounds like it could be nothing but good for an old man like me ! ;)

Spill the beans, Joe . . . what did you learn about it in your studies?

Already excited for Fantasy Camp in January!
Sean's picture
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Glutamine: I was just trying to stoke your fire, Joseph. HA!

Let me sum up what Joe is about to say:

"Nitric Oxide is the most potent free radical in the body and does enough cellular damage to killllllllll youuuuu!!!!!'

Did I get close? ;)

Dedicated to be the best I can be
castin's picture
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WOW! Joe so your saying you could actually replace your PWO with carbs and just BCAA and not protein and get the same benefits?

Ran a 5k (www.cjsbus.org) with Cameron and Lynnea dominated the kids' dash - good way to start a Saturday!
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Alan, I meant Alanine - arginine is so in everyone's head right now that I even confused it!   Though when you have enough protein, it's hard to justify any supplement - even BCAAs - as "necessary" or even worthwhile, it is the competitive nature to do EVERYTHING you can do to get EVERY advantage.  So, if I said 98% of all success could be achieved with just food, but you can spend $400 a month on some supplements that may give you that extra 2%, I know a majority of people would spend the $400.  So, things like BCAAs, glutamine, even HMB, CLA, Alanine, etc - have value.  Just depends how much you want to spend seeing how much value.

 

Castin; you could do that - but the 5 g of BCAAs wouldn't give you as sustained of a nitrogen level in your blood stream.  They are just as effective as the protein, but short lived.  I'd use them for speed and immediate need, but then still follow up with protein within 60 minutes.

@Ben Yea it should be a good one I guess there alot of guys doing it should be really competitive.
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 Us plabs  has some great products I use the anobolic pump, pslin prime and jacked 3d all through my prep.  highly reccomend it to those who havn't tried there products.  

@Ben Yea it should be a good one I guess there alot of guys doing it should be really competitive.
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 glutamine is definatly a must during prep especialy if your drinking tap water even through a brita filter.  I read that tap water tends to pull glutamine out of your muscles in an attemp to keep your bodys ph neutral. 

Laid back European . . . it has been said . .
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Joe

Ah . . . . so you meant Alanine and not Arginine. I would put that slip down to several factors . . . . age, calorie restriction, flipping tyres and too many hours spent in a darkened room watching movies. ;)

I have looked at a few studies on this and they seem to be fairly positive, especially when combining with Creatine, against using Creatine on it's own. What have you experienced yourself, both practically and in your studies?

Curious . . . .

Ran a 5k (www.cjsbus.org) with Cameron and Lynnea dominated the kids' dash - good way to start a Saturday!
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You are a riot, Alan - that was funny!  I leave the forum for a week of traveling and I'm getting pummeled!  ; )

prepping for Mid-America
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On another topic ---who takes Joe's protein (Diet Doc Protein)? I love the stuff. The chocolate is awesome. A few of my friends told me they wouldn't try it because whey isolate didn't head the ingredient list but I told them I've had my best strength gains with this stuff.. Plus I love the taste.

Monster goals!
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Oooh, supplement talk!  Here we go!!!

I buy all of my supplements from "LEGALSTEROIDS.COM" which usually can be found within the 1st 10 pages or so of every Natural Bodybuilding & Fitness magazine.  I like the 3 they recommend in their advertisement:

  • D-BOL - I get this strictly for the label, anything that has a cartoon picture of a cow, horse, dog and pig on it has me sold!  Also, they include the molecular structure diagram, which means it IS actually something.
  • WINNI-V - SDI-Labs makes a chewable tablet hmmm
  • LIQUID ANODROL - I'm sold by the syringe leaning on the bottle.

I'm kidding of course.  I'll never understand why that stuff is in NB&F, seems so hypocritical, but I guess if it comes down to selling ad space...we just skip over those pages, right?

I cycle creatine on and off.  I am currently taking creatine per Joe's instructions of 5g a day.  I really like SciVation's products and take their Xtend (BCAA's & Glutamine) and pre-workout Quake 10.0 (Caffeine & Creatine) .  Other than a daily multi-vitamin, BCAA's in the morning, I take small servings of Revolutionary Technology Nutrition's (RTN) Bionic Edge Whey and Mass Builder when I am short on time, their ingredients are all-natural and the taste is second to none.

Monster goals!
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I didn't mean to kill the supplement talk thread.  Wondering what is the truth/facts behind Sean's poke of Joe:

  • "Nitric Oxide is the most potent free radical in the body and does enough cellular damage to killllllllll youuuuu!!!!!"

Please explain.